TOPIC: HGH and Testosterone

Has anyone heard of any effects from taking these steroids as both have been used on patients for a very long time officially until the USA decided to change laws to stop the use for patients benefits. Without looking at tests or actually asking the Doctors.

Not talking about becoming a weightlifter or anything but want to start thinking about the benefits for someone in my position. I have another 11 weeks of present treatment then if still alive I want to see what help it can give to someone in my position if it will work.

I will be sending for more info from a long time user which I will share then hoping by Xmas I can know for sure any gains will be great.

I go back to Perth Thursday and have been feeling a lot of pain just below my ribs on Liver side and feet keep swelling up but all good head still clear. No I will not be asking the Specialist at SCGH as they are not allowed or not interested in going out of their way.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

These medications continue to be used in the US, especially in private clinics which specialize in countering or mitigating the effects of aging in Men. While both HGH and Testoterone therapy is available under medical supervision, the use of these medications remains somwhat controversial here.

elitemensguide.com/human-growth-hormone-hgh-therapy/

fusion.net/story/42619/why-testosterone-...-drug-of-the-future/

Interesting reading thank you

What got me interested initially was the increase in blood flow and after reading some of the articles and tests it seems that they are both very misunderstood drugs. No thanks to the German then USA and Russia getting juiced up to win at all cost Athletic Bodies.

My contact is going to check out side effects for the Liver but says from what he knows I should be ok to try it. The way I see it is I don't have much to lose whether I take it or not, I have 10 weeks before I do so I should be able to get some good info.

Certain hormones and in particular steroids (or their dosage) might be a problem with liver damage. I believe it was primarily a steroid amongst some lesser drugs which was largely responsible for my post coma/ICU decompensation - thereby eliminating my option in 2011 for interferon treatment. I had to wait till 2015 for non inf treatment which might have been a blessing were it not for the unfortunate emergence, meanwhile, of HCC. I would advise - caution & scrupulous investigation before proceeding with such powerful ingredients.
cheers archer

Steroids facilitate virus entry into cells. They help the virus multiply.

" Two possible mechanisms for a steroid-mediated effect on HCV viral loads can be postulated, the first being a direct effect of steroids on the virus by enhancing its replication. The second, an indirect effect due to the suppression of the HCV immune response, allows unrestricted HCV replication."

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17911459
P.

Hi Woobia, I am sorry to read of your health situation.

I would be extremely wary of steroids in your situation.

This said from experience of someone I knew.

Please think very carefully about taking this path.

Good to hear you're feeling more engaged in life, My very best wishes to you. Keep the faith.

Please read my post about Testosterone in men here:

gp2u.blogspot.com.au/2014/12/testosteron...ou-be-taking-it.html

You should start by having a morning level taken. If it's <10 that's on the low side but if it's 15-20 that's probably normal enough.

Human Growth Hormone has been put forward as the elixir of youth and it certainly sees abuse in elite athletes as a performance enhancer. Boby builders use it with testosterone and similar steroids to bulk up. Anti-ageing gurus use it in cocktails.

The impact of HGH on health adults is largely unknown. Here is what the Mayo has to say about it:

www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/hea...hormone/art-20045735

In excess it causes acromegaly. Remember "Jaws" from the James Bond Movies?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaws_(James_Bond)

The actor who played that character had acromegaly from making too much HGH and his weirdly big head, hands and height were are part of the impact it has.

THE EFFECT OF TESTOSTERONE THERAPY ON MUSCLE MASS, BONE MASS AND HAEMOGLOBIN IN HYPOGONADAL MEN WITH CIRRHOSIS

M. Sinclair1,2, P. Gow1,2, M. Grossmann2,3, R. Hoermann2,
T. Scodellaro2, P. Angus1,2. 1Gastroenterology and Hepatology, Austin
Health; 2Medicine, The University of Melbourne; 3Endocrinology, Austin
Health, Melbourne, Australia

Background and Aims:

Low testosterone and sarcopenia are common in men with cirrhosis and both are associated with adverse outcome. The effect of testosterone therapy on body composition has not previously been investigated in this population.

Methods: We conducted a 12 month double-blinded, randomised, placebo-controlled trial of intramuscular testosterone decanoate in 101 men with established cirrhosis and low serum testosterone (total testosterone <12 nmol/L or free testosterone <230 pmol/L). Total body composition was quantified using dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry.

Results: Appendicular lean muscle mass was significantly higher in the active group compared to placebo at 12 months (mean adjusted
difference (MAD) 1.69 kg, CI 0.40–2.97 kg, p = 0.021). Total lean mass was similarly higher in the active group (MAD 4.74 kg, CI 1.75– 7.74 kg, p = 0.008). Fat mass was lower in the actively treated group (MAD−4.34 kg, CI−2.04 to −6.64 kg, p < 0.001). Bone mineral density was significantly higher at the femoral neck and total bone mass were both significantly higher in the active group (MAD in T score 0.287 points, CI 0.140–0.4340.140–0.434, p < 0.001; (MAD in bone mass 0.08 kg, CI 0.01–0.15 kg, p = 0.009). Haemoglobin was significantly higher in actively treated patients (MAD 10.2 g/L, CI 1.50–18.9 g/L, p = 0.041) and HbA1cwas lower (MAD −0.35%, CI −0.05 to −0.54, p = 0.028). No serious adverse effects were reported. There were more deaths on placebo (25.5%) than active treatment (16%) but this was not significant (p = 0.352).

Conclusions: Testosterone therapy in men with cirrhosis and low baseline testosterone levels safely improves muscle mass, bone mass and haemoglobin, and reduces fat mass and HbA1c. This is a promising new therapy for systemic complications of cirrhosis that targets a specific hormonal imbalance in men with cirrhosis.

Journal of Hepatology 2016 vol. 64 | S133–S158

Thanks GT2,

The key point is "hypogonadal". I said <10 they used <12. We used to treat (with government subsidy) at <8 but it's been reduced to <6

Anyway step 1 remains TEST the Testosterone level.

The outcomes noted in this trial are the standard outcomes of testosterone replacement in men where levels are low. There are a few other benefits like dropping the need for Viagra and better blood lipids not mentioned.

Since I did peg interferon ribavirin in 2003, I've suffered from low testosterone levels.
My endocrinologist put me on testosterone injections ( Reandron 1000mg undecanoate )
These injections last from 3mths to 6mths when my testosterone levels go below 5.
I've more then likely had HCV since 1970.
My viral load got to 2million just before starting the DAA's .
Not sure if there's been any more damage to my liver using testosterone therapy.
Without these injections I couldn't function .

Got back from Perth today after Spec and Clinic visit on 23rd, went to go 60klm to see my old Doc as she has been great when she was here. Got halfway and they phone and say she is sick etc, I was a bit pissed off but. My mate lives there and I was gunna see him but I couldn't contact him as his phone was out. Sitting on the side of freeway and bugger me dead my Doc rings me text her address and said come around.

Went to dinner that night with her kids and friend and again Sat night, I had aball and even got down to see my mate and at his new address on the River. He is moving in but it will take him 2 months as he has heaps of gear to move. I have a heap of blood test requests forms and added the Testosterone to one which I will get done next week. My friend reckons 1 will be high and the other low she did say which ones but I am sending her a copy of the results.

I was a bit sore Sat night in my inner thighs but it is getting worse and now it has become a struggle to walk, can't believe it. I dont want to take pain killers but I might weaken, just started enjoying my life again and another kik up the ass.
I have 2 motto's 1/ We are all here to Eat, Shit and Die. 2/ You only get out of life what you Deserve. I was never an Angel but it hasn't missed me.

If anyone knows about the pain and what it could mean I would love to hear as I googled and that just made me more confused as I have 2 hernias in my guts with one quite large.

Good Luck All Barry

I have been self administering Delatestryl (Testosterone Enanthate) 50 18mg X 2 per week to offset a very low T score <3 . I keep it at an average of 14 and it is monitored by my FD every 2 months. I take 50 mg of zinc to offset the E2 excess and have been doing this for 11 years. Before I start on this I had one incident where I was unable to bring a table up 2 flights of stairs and was in a very bad place mentally because of chronic insomnia and constant joint pain. Sex was out of the question as I would look at women then the same way you would look at a really nice power tool or a Harley parked outside , just there and good looking and that was it.

I tested positive for HCV antibodies last week and just had my RNA test this morning so am at the start of the learning curve. The suspected date of infection was about 25 years ago and I have had about 5 months of increasing fatigue and joint stiffness. I am open to any of the Redemption paks and will wait for the RNA to come back and my doctor to decide which is best for a hopeful cure. Would this regime harm my chances at recovery or is this ok? Without test I am a mess and quite honestly was borderline depressed before I started. I use it only to maintain a decent life standard and not for any body building. The frequent smaller doses are used to offset the peaks and valleys that I felt with the larger bimonthly doses. I take HCH 4 times per year to stop my HPA axis from flatlining (FSH is < 1 for example)

Hey SHarmon,
Welcome to the forum.

Once you know if you are HCV antigen positive, and if so, what type of HCV, then you'll be in a position to find the best treatment for your own situation.

You can then go to the interactions checker:
www.hep-druginteractions.org/checker
To use this online tool one first enters the HVC drug regimen. Next one adds the other pharmaceutical or vitamin, mineral etc., you need to check interactions for. This is a great online tool. Great for doctors as well as us civilians.

Best wishes for your next steps, Mnem

Welcome to the forum SHarmon,

You can keep taking your testosterone while being treated.

Men not on testosterone treatment make it themselves and at the average age of 55 have about the 15 units in their system. That's no different to you other than the fact we make it in a factory and you inject it.

SHarmon wrote:
Wow! Sounds very familiar to me, and now that I read this whole thread including the comments from Dr. Freeman, hi doc! I will get my "T" tested as I'm certain it's low but blood tests always work better than my brain and if I get a blood test I will know for sure. I appreciate your post here SHarman, you're not alone at all. ~Cheers!