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TOPIC: How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills

How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21623

  • DrJames
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From Bloomberg:

Nothing about a Washington state lawsuit called B.E. v. Teeter is as simple as it seems.

It was filed this year by two hepatitis C patients against the state’s Medicaid program to help the poor gain access to drugs such as Gilead Sciences Inc.’s $1,000-a-pill cure.

But behind the team bringing the case is Gilead itself. While the drug giant isn’t involved in the lawsuit, the company and its foundation have donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to the researchers, lawyers, patient advocates and medical expert who have helped build the case.

Gilead said its donations have nothing to do with the legal fight. If the plaintiffs prevail, however, Gilead and other drug companies stand to make billions because Washington’s Medicaid program would be forced to cover expensive treatments -- and other states may be pressured to follow suit.


www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-09-...o-cover-pricey-pills
YMMV
Last Edit: 5 years 1 month ago by DrJames.
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21626

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didn't happen to donate the pills as well, did they?

J.
GT3a 1990 Failed Inter 1998, comb in 2000. HCC 2012
Started 24/52 Sof/Dac 27th October 2015.
1. Bloods 2 October 2015: AST - 165 (20-40), ALT - 265 (5-40), GGT 189 (5-50)
2, Bloods 20 November 2015: ALT etc normal; VL 19
3. Bloods 8 January 2016: AST - 40, ALT - 59, GGT 48 VL RNA UND
4. EOT 12 April 2016 - blood tests: all is well, CT scan: okay
5. AFP 11 June 2016: 4 ref< 11
6. VL July 2016: DET
7. Oct16 start treat - June17 UND
8. Jun 18, lfts okay, platelets a bit low.
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21629

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This doesn't surprise me a bit. People (like me) in the US are howling about their insurers not covering these outlandishly expensive drugs when they should be complaining about the manufacturer charging these ridiculous prices.
If insurers (both private & government) are forced to pay Gilead's ransom, the cost will be passed right to their clients the next fiscal year in the form of premiums & taxes.
In the end, it only seems logical that the government pay Gilead the big bucks since the same government paid to research and develop its flagship product, sofosbuvir.
What a mess.
Thank God and James Freeman for generics.
m
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forums.delphiforums.com/generichcvtx

G 1a F-1
Started tx 10/23/15 (Meso sof & led) ALT 48 AST 28 v/l 1.6 mil
11/17/15 4 wk lab ALT 17 AST 16 <15
11/18/15 Started Harvoni
12/16/15 8 wk lab ALT: 15 AST: 13 V/l UND
1/14/16 Fin. Tx
7/07/16 UND SVR 24
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21633

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mgalbrai wrote:
This doesn't surprise me a bit. People (like me) in the US are howling about their insurers not covering these outlandishly expensive drugs when they should be complaining about the manufacturer charging these ridiculous prices.
...................
Thank God and James Freeman for generics.
m

Similar things I noticed also in RO. I've heard many patient's complaints and also read a lot of "honest" articles where HCV advocacy groups are targeting the budget of the healthcare system in order to create pressure so that the government will allocate and pay more money for treating the HCV patients. Oh, and how they master to play the "song" of patient's safety.......

Sometimes I am questioning myself whether keeping the treatment prices extremely high opens the gate for bribery.....
Here is a short extract from Wikipedia about the bribery in medicine (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bribery#Medicine)

Medicine

Pharmaceutical corporations may seek to entice doctors to favor prescribing their drugs over others of comparable effectiveness. If the medicine is prescribed heavily, they may seek the reward the individual through gifts.[7] The American Medical Association has published ethical guidelines for gifts from industry which include the tenet that physicians should not accept gifts if they are given in relation to the physician’s prescribing practices.[8] Doubtful cases include grants for traveling to medical conventions that double as tourist trips.

Dentists often receive samples of home dental care products such as toothpaste, which are of negligible value; somewhat ironically, dentists in a television commercial will often state that they get these samples but pay to use the sponsor's product.

In countries offering state-subsidized or nationally funded healthcare where medical professionals are underpaid, patients may use bribery to solicit the standard expected level of medical care. For example, in many formerly Communist countries from what used to be the Eastern Bloc it may be customary to offer expensive gifts to doctors and nurses for the delivery of service at any level of medical care in the non-private health sector.[9][10]


This last paragraph really makes me sad....
In fiecare an HCV ucide peste 500000 oameni.Medicamentele generice pentru hepatita C functioneaza. Nu deveni statistica! Cauta pe Google “medicamente generice pentru hepatita C”.
HCV kills more than 500000 people every year. HCV generic drugs work. Don't become a statistic.
By sharing this Youtube video you might save someone’s life!
My TX: HEPCVIR-L[generic Harvoni]-India
SVR52 achieved
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21634

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mgalbrai wrote:
This doesn't surprise me a bit. People (like me) in the US are howling about their insurers not covering these outlandishly expensive drugs when they should be complaining about the manufacturer charging these ridiculous prices.
If insurers (both private & government) are forced to pay Gilead's ransom, the cost will be passed right to their clients the next fiscal year in the form of premiums & taxes.
In the end, it only seems logical that the government pay Gilead the big bucks since the same government paid to research and develop its flagship product, sofosbuvir.
What a mess.
Thank God and James Freeman for generics.
m

Interesting situation now for us in Australia where the meds are PBS listed.

Moral question:

"Do I pay the PBS price, that is not very much if you are working, and let me and my fellow citizens fork out the rest through taxes, or do I pay significantly, but not extravagantly more, for generics?"

The answer in all commonsense and justice is use the PBS, but it's still something difficult for reasonable people to get their head around I should think.

I wonder if the high paid 'executives' of big companies burden themselves with these types of questions?

J.
GT3a 1990 Failed Inter 1998, comb in 2000. HCC 2012
Started 24/52 Sof/Dac 27th October 2015.
1. Bloods 2 October 2015: AST - 165 (20-40), ALT - 265 (5-40), GGT 189 (5-50)
2, Bloods 20 November 2015: ALT etc normal; VL 19
3. Bloods 8 January 2016: AST - 40, ALT - 59, GGT 48 VL RNA UND
4. EOT 12 April 2016 - blood tests: all is well, CT scan: okay
5. AFP 11 June 2016: 4 ref< 11
6. VL July 2016: DET
7. Oct16 start treat - June17 UND
8. Jun 18, lfts okay, platelets a bit low.
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21637

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Interesting question J,

In the Australian case*, what we have heard from the advocacy groups is that the PBS (correctly taxpayers) are apparently paying a total of A$1 billion for up to 65,000 treatments over the next five years with any treatments above that quantity being provided at nil cost by the pharmaceutical companies. Keep in mind that those numbers are supposedly "per treatment" rather than per 12 weeks of a particular drug although I assume there will also be some sort of rollover and annual quotas fine print in the agreements that attempts to favour the company bottom lines. Overall though, that works out to less than A$16k per treatment assuming we get the full numbers treated and as low as A$4.5k if we manage to treat every one of the estimated 230,000 with HCV in this country. The latter being an unlikely but worthy goal.

Those costs are still quite high for a drug that costs less than US$100/A$130 to manufacture and up to nearly 10x higher than generics pricing however given the capped pricing and the Australian government's likely continued adherence to patent laws a reasonably strong case can be made for advocacy for as many Australians as possible to access what is effectively a fixed level of PBS funding within the five year period. i.e. Once we hit target taxpayers don't fork out any more for extra patients to treat so effectively we are renegotiating a lower pricing structure for each extra person.

(* I believe that the improved access/pricing situation in Australia, while no doubt due to some hard headed negotiations by our government, was enabled because of some very effective grass roots advocacy for generics by a couple of Tasmanians and some NSW pharmacies that definitely were not funded by big pharma :cheer: )
G3a since '78 - Dx '12 - F4 (2xHCC)
24wk Tx - PEG/Riba/Dac 2013 relapsed
24wk Tx - Generic Sof/Dac/Riba 2015/16 relapsed
16wk Tx - 12/01/17 -> 03/05/17 NS3/NS5a + Generic Sof
SVR7 - 22/06/17 UND
SRV12 - 27/07/17 UND
SVR24 - 26/10/17 UND
:cheer: :cheer: :cheer:
Last Edit: 5 years 1 month ago by Gaj.
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21640

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James-Freeman-facebook wrote:

Gilead said its donations have nothing to do with the legal fight. If the plaintiffs prevail, however, Gilead and other drug companies stand to make billions because Washington’s Medicaid program would be forced to cover expensive treatments -- and other states may be pressured to follow suit.[/i]

www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-09-...o-cover-pricey-pills

That seriously makes me want to vomit. :sick: Or punch something. :evil: Or maybe both. In no particular order. No wonder the world is in an uproar
Genotype 1a
Diagnosed in 2004, had HCV for all my adult life. Until 2016!!!!
Harvoni treatment, started 19 March 2016
4 week results Bilirubin 12 down from 14 pre treatment,
Gamma 25 down from 52, ALT 19 down from 63, AST 19 down from 47,
VL <15 down from a lazy 6 million or so

EOT Results
Bilirubin 10, GGT 18, ALT 19, AST 21, VL UND

12 Weeks post EOT
Bilirubin 11, GGT 16, ALT 22, AST 20, VL UND
Cured baby
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21645

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Gaj wrote:
Interesting question J,

Overall though, that works out to less than A$16k per treatment assuming we get the full numbers treated and as low as A$4.5k if we manage to treat every one of the estimated 230,000 with HCV in this country. The latter being an unlikely but worthy goal.

(* I believe that the improved access/pricing situation in Australia, while no doubt due to some hard headed negotiations by our government, was enabled because of some very effective grass roots advocacy for generics by a couple of Tasmanians and some NSW pharmacies that definitely were not funded by big pharma :cheer: )

Hi Gaj,

A part of me (near my back pocket) thinks that if the government spent my hard earn't tax money more wisely, they could even reduce this bill further, say to $1600.00 per head, by buying generics.

Could not agree more about the Tasmanians and New South Welshmen.

Pity Gilead does not have the patent on nuclear weapons and the like.

Yours

J.
GT3a 1990 Failed Inter 1998, comb in 2000. HCC 2012
Started 24/52 Sof/Dac 27th October 2015.
1. Bloods 2 October 2015: AST - 165 (20-40), ALT - 265 (5-40), GGT 189 (5-50)
2, Bloods 20 November 2015: ALT etc normal; VL 19
3. Bloods 8 January 2016: AST - 40, ALT - 59, GGT 48 VL RNA UND
4. EOT 12 April 2016 - blood tests: all is well, CT scan: okay
5. AFP 11 June 2016: 4 ref< 11
6. VL July 2016: DET
7. Oct16 start treat - June17 UND
8. Jun 18, lfts okay, platelets a bit low.
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21648

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Another article that just does your head in. I agree M....what a mess. The inevitable increase in the cost of health insurance will just keep everyone trapped in this complicated, messy cycle unless there are more circuit breakers like Dr F and the generic meds.

What a statement from Gilead's spokeperson. " Gilead's grant program is not a commercial strategy". Seriously?
G1a probably early 1980's, Biopsy F1(2010), F2-F3(2015). VL 5+mill; 2+mill (2014) Tx naive. Accessed Sof/Led through Dr Freeman at GP2U and Buyers Club (lifesavers!!!)
Commenced tx 12/11/15. 9 wk: VL <15 Detected but LFT = Normal 12 week results: UND (Yay!) Due to slow response commenced Sof/Dac 4 Feb for 12 weeks. EOT @ 24 weeks 27 April 2016. (With thanks to Dr Freeman et al). SVR11 result: VL 1,950,000. It's back!
New tx 030916 (Viekira Pak, Solvadi, Ribavirin UND @ 111116. EOT 170217.
SVR12 and SVR 24...
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21649

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Just a quick thought about Big Pharma's money and ..... the EASL conference from Paris taking place soon.

After the ILC Barcelona when Dr. Freeman presented the REDEMPTION results and the wonderful press release that followed immediately stating that HCV generic medication is same efficient as the branded treatment, I was hoping that all future EASL conferences will insist more and more on the role of generics.

But now, when I see that this event from Paris is being sponsored by Big Pharma, I kind of lost my hope... I really hope I am wrong on this one. The program of the conference may be found here: www.easloffice.eu/office/paris2016/mobile/index.html#p=1

Cheers,
RHF
In fiecare an HCV ucide peste 500000 oameni.Medicamentele generice pentru hepatita C functioneaza. Nu deveni statistica! Cauta pe Google “medicamente generice pentru hepatita C”.
HCV kills more than 500000 people every year. HCV generic drugs work. Don't become a statistic.
By sharing this Youtube video you might save someone’s life!
My TX: HEPCVIR-L[generic Harvoni]-India
SVR52 achieved
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How Big Pharma Pressures States to Pay for Pricey Pills 5 years 1 month ago #21667

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It's only activism that will make a difference in the suffering of HCV patients.

The western countries have the patent system that allows for a monopoly for many years. In the case of the USA, the government will not introduce any sort of price controls.

All of my Doctor's were surprised to hear of the insurance denials. They were all interested to hear how I was able to cure myself.

Gilead CEO made $1 billion dollars last year. That is truly absurd.
Gt 1a, F0, VL 6.5 million, AST 59, ALT 62
Started Twinvir 1/15/16
6 wk. labs VL UND, AST 27, ALT 20
EOT labs VL UND, AST 23, ALT 19
SVR 16, VL UND, AST 28, ALT 17
SVR 24 , VL UND, 10/8/16
SVR 125, VL UND, 9/22/18
SVR 230, VL UND, 10/3/20
Last Edit: 5 years 1 month ago by Greedfighter.
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